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LA Times on the San Gabriels (Read 468 times)
dryflyin
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LA Times on the San Gabriels
May 16th, 2010, 10:23am
 
The LA Times wrote an article on strengthening protections on various waters in the San Gabriel Mountains, including the San Gabriel River and Lytle Creek: http://bit.ly/bdXHDU
 
If you'd like to voice your opinion to the bill's backer in Congress, David Dreier of San Dimas, go here: http://dreier.house.gov/contact.shtml
 
The article states LA County's Department of Public Works supports these efforts for expanded Wild and Scenic designations, but is balking because they don't want anything that might restrict their ability to operate Cogswell Dam.  I suspect that's beauracratese for they don't want to commit to minimum flows or have to think about the fishery when making large releases.  You can urge the LADPW to fully support the fishery at this page http://dpw.lacounty.gov/general/faq/index.cfm?action=NewQuestion or send email to info@dpw.lacounty.gov .
 
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Trout Hunter
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Re: LA Times on the San Gabriels
Reply #1 - May 16th, 2010, 12:15pm
 
Would like to see those fisheries improved. The San Gabriel was once a really nice fishery. The major problem is enforcement. The gang bangers and poachers have taken over the area with road access. It will be great to have the wilderness designation but designation without real protection (law enforcement) is not enough. It would be nice if having that status would mean extra money and resources to clean up the "trash" and the garbage they leave behind! Anyway, it's a start. Thanks for the info.
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Joe

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dryflyin
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Re: LA Times on the San Gabriels
Reply #2 - May 16th, 2010, 12:28pm
 
Quote from Trout Hunter on May 16th, 2010, 12:15pm:
The major problem is enforcement. The gang bangers and poachers have taken over the area with road access. It will be great to have the wilderness designation but designation without real protection (law enforcement) is not enough. It would be nice if having that status would mean extra money and resources to clean up the "trash" and the garbage they leave behind!

 
Agree 100%.  In fact, I am somewhat jaded of the current cleanup only approach as merely treating the symptom and not preventing the disease.  I sent the LA Times reporter a short rant to that effect, complete with pictures of giant trash piles I took on there last October.
 
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Dances with Bears
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Re: LA Times on the San Gabriels
Reply #3 - May 18th, 2010, 6:00pm
 
Quote from Trout Hunter on May 16th, 2010, 12:15pm:
Would like to see those fisheries improved. The San Gabriel was once a really nice fishery. The major problem is enforcement. The gang bangers and poachers have taken over the area with road access. It will be great to have the wilderness designation but designation without real protection (law enforcement) is not enough. It would be nice if having that status would mean extra money and resources to clean up the "trash" and the garbage they leave behind! Anyway, it's a start. Thanks for the info.

 
Yeah the San Gabriel Canyon used to have 5 district rangers who shared the admin and the patrol duties.  SGC now only has 1 district ranger who also is responsible for a ton of other land.  That '1' is therefore now burried under admin duties. Period.  When the forest service was started, it was in reaction to a back asswards roll out of regulations.  Would you believe that the Govt set up Forest Service regulations without anyone to patrol..  THEN they decided that no one was following the rules because no one was there to enforce.  So they started the idea of a ranger who would actually 'range'.  And they sent this person out and he had a job IN THE FIELD.  yadda yadda yadda, red tape, no support, yadda yadda, washington, yadda, Increase in population without increase in number of patrols HA HA HA HO HO HO and a couple of tra-la la's it's how we laugh the day away in the merry ol land of OZ and here we are.  The Govt used to work for the FS, but those days are long gone.  Now the FS works for the govt. Period.  So you know what that means.  Should you support the new designations? - absolutely.  But I encourage you not to stop there if you feel that you might be willing to put on a uniform.  
 
Currently Volunteer Patrols can earn a uniform through the FS.  Hear me out.  most of the time spent earning the uniform is on the river, having positive effect.  It is an official uniform with a very minor difference in the little badge pin you wear.  Myself and several members of the West Fork Conservancy are working toward earning our uniform.  We are in direct contact with the FS and are doing everything that is possible via uniformed presence.  We are not allowed to ticket, but we go out with a team leader who has a forest service radio, so we are the eyes and ears and the uniformed presence.  We do pick up trash, because we can't ignore it.  and you can keep the trash to a minimum by cleaning up after these people (are you my mother?), but the only way to mitigate the trash is to increase the Uniformed Presence.  Currently the e, w, and n forks are patrolled aproximately 4 days a month from 8 to 4pm (typically saturday).  On the days of the patrol, there is a drastic increase in compliance.  I've seen it first hand.  YES, I've seen the compliance first hand.  I'd say the system is insufficient because plan A is failing (the govt)  but as far as plan B (volunteers) it's only failing because there are not more days of the month that it is patrolled (by volunteers).  This because there are not enough volunteers.  I've gone on several patrols and learned/witnessed/verified a couple of things for certain - even though we are only volunteer patrols:  1) people comply when they see the uniform.  2) people violate when the uniform isn't staring them in the face.  
 
We continue to learn, but our goal is simple: be trained, be in unoform, and be there.  And there will always be the want to have more 'actual law enforcement' which is a sentiment I share.  I will follow up on these articles and movements, although I'm lacking in confidence that any Govt action will lead to a constant uniformed presence.  At best it will always be a combination of FS employees and Volunteer patrols in order to get constant presence.
 
Trust me this is the stepping stone toward a brighter future for the canyon.
 
If you wish to see more of a uniformed presence, and are willing to try a few patrols in order to see if you like it, please contact me at 323-804-7329.  
 
I could type forever about the reasons this is needed, and yes I do understand that in a perfect world volunteers wouldn't be needed.  Yes I understand that there is redtape.  But in the end, we are talking about a government that has NEVER provided sufficient patrols.  I got tired of being angry.  I considered the popular definition of insanity: repeating the same action over and over and expecting a different result.  Aka, I'm going insane by repeatedly expecting the Govt to deal with it.  I'm tired of being angry.  and since I started by becoming a volunteer, I don't feel as angry and I feel that progress is being made.  So the river quality inches it's way up and I have a better overall outlook.  please think about that.  An increase in compliance and less anger for you.  Sounds pretty good just saying it, but it feels even better.  the anger is heavier than you think... relieve yourself of some of it by trying our program.  Feel free to e.mail me (cris.miller@westforksgrc.org), post here, or call me at 323-804-7329.
 
Volunteer Forest service training is this saturday from 830 to 430 meeting at the locked gate at the top of azusa canyon. Please contact me if you are interested.
 
I can tell you that patrolling the West Fork is a pleasure.  Without seeing it for yourself, it's easy to imagine all that you are up against and just plain get mad.  Call me 323-804-7329 Cris Miller
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http://westforksgrc.org - West Fork Conservancy
The logs of wood which move down the river together are driven apart by every wave. Such inevitable parting shoud not be the cause of misery.
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Trout Hunter
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Re: LA Times on the San Gabriels
Reply #4 - May 18th, 2010, 7:55pm
 
Thanks for giving the area a chance to recover. I just would have hoped, with all the billions the government is spending on the "recovery", some of that money would have provided for jobs to protect places like the San Gabriel; provide jobs, help the forest. It's sad that volunteers, like yourself, have to step up and do what the government should be doing.
 
Smiley Keep up the good work Trout Thumb, it's appreciated!
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Joe

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Wildman
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Re: LA Times on the San Gabriels
Reply #5 - May 18th, 2010, 11:54pm
 
I've been a USFS volunteer for a number of years (even when I was employed at the fire department) and my focus has been on educating young people on the importance our forests and how to take care of them.  I work at the Angeles Visitor's Center near my home in Wrightwood when the school kids come up.  My section has always been Smokey Bear and Fire Prevention but we also have segments on what and what not to do in the Forest....Hug a Tree if they get lost....what animals and birds live in the forest and sometimes some animal and bird demos.  My uniform in this picture has dungarees because it's part of the Smokey program but normally I wear my FS green pants.  
 


 
On this particular day, 180 1st Graders from the city learned about how to care for their forest.  It's a long day but it's fun to watch their faces as they interact with Smokey Bear.
 
I also clean heads once a week from Jackson Lake to Vincent gap.  It's not glamorous but it means they will be clean for the folks who only have the weekends to recreate in the forest.  When the back country opens up in a few weeks, we will be rebuilding trails and putting trail signs back up.    
 
I have always been shown great courtesy by the general public.  I do not do enforcement but will educate whenever possible when I come upon some "misguided" souls.  I heartily recommend volunteering for the forest service or BLM or Fish and Game.
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"Life is hard. It's harder if you're stupid." John Wayne
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Dances with Bears
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Re: LA Times on the San Gabriels
Reply #6 - May 19th, 2010, 9:49am
 
Volunteer Forest service training is this saturday from 830 to 430 meeting at the locked gate at the top of azusa canyon. Please contact me if you are interested. Cris.miller@westforksgrc.org 323-804-7329
 
I left a few things out yesterday and have a few things to add:
First, Thank you to Dry flyn for flushing out this info, I always apreciate your keen eye, and I'm burried enough that I didn't even see the articles, so thank you and please keep on looking out for this stuff.  I'm not knocking it at all.
 
Joe, I agree with you that it is sad that they can't put more Forest Service patrols.  It's bewildering when your standing at the river seeing the need first hand.  also considering that the SCG serves so many los angelinos it's hard to believe that our lobby doesn't get more Rangers in the area.  
 
Wildman, Thanks for showing and sharing.  You hit the nail on the head about children.  There are studies that show that children who come in contact with adults in conservation efforts are more apt to be in conservation efforts themselves.  Fostering the future, while adressing the problem today.
 
Thanks Guys, I appreciate all you have done before me and all you do to help the cause.
 
The bottom line is that the more Uniforms are in the area, the more the area has a sense of society.  The more the area has a sense of society, the less it will be the hang out spot that people go to to get away from authority.  Our methods of 'educating' as volunteers instead of 'ticketing' keep us safe, and you'd be surprised how they automatically assume that you can ticket them when they see the FS uniform.  It's slight of hand, but we use all we can to outsmart the problem, and stay safe ourselves.  It's not an easy concept to grasp, but the reasons for it reveal themselves the farther you get into the understanding.
 
And by growing the volunteer organization, we will find that once you reach a balance point (which will definately require patrolling more than 1 day a week as currently ocurrs), the graffiti and trash begin to dwindle.  I believe it.
 
Volunteer Forest service training is this saturday from 830 to 430 meeting at the locked gate at the top of azusa canyon. Please contact me if you are interested. Cris.miller@westforksgrc.org 323-804-7329
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http://westforksgrc.org - West Fork Conservancy
The logs of wood which move down the river together are driven apart by every wave. Such inevitable parting shoud not be the cause of misery.
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